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Author Topic: FSX ‘OK 3 Wire’ Carrier Land Video & NATOPS URLs  (Read 5537 times)
SpazSinbad
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« on: September 26, 2010, 09:33:37 PM »

FSX Blue Angels excellent tutorial on 'how to carrier land & FCLP':

-On FSX Blues website: http://fsxblueangels.com/videoscreen%20ok3.html (115Mb .FLV)

-On Vimeo (better quality): http://www.vimeo.com/2950519 (155?Mb .MP4?)

-Download (very high quality): http://www.megaupload.com/?d=7UQJCCZA (331Mb .WMV)
________________

LSO NATOPS 2007: http://www.wings-of-gold.com/cnatra/LSO_NATOPS_2007.pdf (2.2Mb)

LSO Reference Manual 1999: http://63.192.133.13/VMF-312/LSO.pdf (5.5Mb)

CV NATOPS 2009: http://info.publicintelligence.net/CV-NATOPS-JUL09.pdf (5.7Mb)
« Last Edit: September 27, 2010, 09:09:32 AM by SpazSinbad » Logged

SpazSinbad
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« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2010, 10:13:24 PM »

For trent, (the original thread wanders all over the place - so I wandered here)  Grin

Further to the 'smooth' flying comments. Everything is relative and I suspect 'smooth' as used in these comments by VX squadron Hornet pilots when testing new IFLOLS (and comparing it to the old FLOLS system) these are their comments in a summary (about new accuracy of IFLOLS etc.) about 'how to fly' IFLOLS (with many extra smaller cells showing glideslope):

"Lessons (Re)Learned
• Meatball / Line-up / AOA scan hasn’t changed
– Ball deviations will seem to be larger and happen faster
• Smoother corrections to highs work best to ‘stairstep’
the ball down to center
• Don’t lead a low ball; expect to move it up past
the datums, then work it down
• Never re-center a high ball in close
• With the ball stabilized at the top of the lens, the
aircraft should still trap (like FLOLS)"

That last comment would apply to being in relation to second last comment. I'm hoping it is clear that the pilots speak about detail they see, probably detail we have no hope of seeing in FSX, yet we strive to do the best at all times, given the limitations discussed in the other thread.
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SpazSinbad
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FLY NAVY! RAN FAA ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀ A4G Skyhawk Early '70s


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« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2010, 01:19:46 PM »

A FREE 2GB PDF about "How to Deck Land" (amongst other things) has been uploaded today to:

www.a4ghistory.com  Best to go there to look at the readme top of page and to 'right click' or use a file manager to download the PDF. The PDF is a collection of material already in the 4.4GB PDF about the A4G Skyhawk etc. so as such the 2GB PDF collection of excerpts is not a coherent 'read from start to finish' instructional PDF but there is enough information in it to bamboozle anyone - including me.  Grin  There are extra videos included that are not in the main 4.4GB PDF due to file size limitations. Enjoy. Quiz tomorrow 0800 sharp.   Roll Eyes  Cool Cheesy

FileName is: "How_Deck_Land_Excerpts+29sep2010.pdf" (top of page - 2GB)

{EDIT} Apologies for not including this download advice (on the page in further detail if scrolled): "Please use a download manager or 'right mouse click' on the download URL below to "Save target as" to your computer. As indicated further down the page all these PDFs must be viewed on Windows XP SP2 or above computers using the latest Adobe Reader 9.3.4 or better (when available). MAC users will have varying results with these PDFs I'm told (but I don't have a MAC because they are ...)."  Grin

If users just 'left mouse click' on the download URL at top of page it is likely the download will fail at some point and if the latest version of Adobe Reader is not used then there are likely to be issues with viewing the PDF. Adobe Reader will be updated again soon (within a few days) due to security issues I'm told.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2010, 06:41:30 PM by SpazSinbad » Logged

Sludge
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« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2010, 04:20:19 PM »

Spaz...

Clicked on the link and it says something like "the file is damaged and cannot be repaired."  Disregard... I read it all and I'm running on a computer with WinXP, SP3.  Sorry for the boneheadedness.

Thanks for the other stuff though, good CV candy for us carrier pattern lovers.

Later
Sludge
« Last Edit: September 29, 2010, 04:22:45 PM by Sludge » Logged

SpazSinbad
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FLY NAVY! RAN FAA ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀ A4G Skyhawk Early '70s


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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2010, 06:26:15 PM »

Sludge, Probably there needs to be a reminder (there are a bunch further down the page if you scroll) that the file URL should not be 'left clicked' but right clicked for a 'Save As' or use a File Manager for download. Adobe Reader is not good for downloading any large files from any site usually, especially this one. I'll put a reminder about this there now.

Please try again to let me know if you have success. I can download the file by 'right clicking' etc.

Also I'll remind users that only Adobe Reader 9.3.4 can be used to view the PDF. Win XP users must have the latest Service Pack 2 or higher plus Windows Media Player 10 or higher including the Flash plugin (all detailed on the page if scrolled). It is likely the left mouse click on the URL method will get a quick complaint if Adobe Reader is not up to date I guess?
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trent
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« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2010, 05:27:42 PM »

Awesome stuff Spaz, reading through the CV-NATOPS now.  Particularly fond of the information in sections 6.4.2.2 and .3:

Quote
6.2.4.2 Downwind Leg and Approach Turn
The landing pattern downwind leg is flown at 600 feet, 1 to 1-1/2 nm abeam the ship’s stern. Aircraft in the VFR Day
Landing Pattern should be established in the intended landing configuration, wings level at 600 feet with landing
checklist complete by the 180. At the 180, the aircraft should begin the approach turn and gradual descent to pass
the 90-degree position at 450 to 500 feet. The pilot should continue the approach turn until intercepting the extended
centerline of the ship’s angled deck and acquire the optical landing system meatball image. The approach turn from
the 180 to the start should take 45 seconds.

6.2.4.3 Groove and Touchdown
The aircraft should roll wings level on centerline with a centered ball to allow a 15 – 18 second groove before aircraft
touchdown on deck. At touchdown the pilot shall add power as appropriate, and prepare to bolter. Following
arrestment, the pilot shall follow the instructions of the aircraft directors and comply with the procedures in NAVAIR
00-80T-120 (CV Flight/Hangar Deck NATOPS manual).

I don't think I've read those times anywhere else (180 to start = 45 seconds, groove = 15-18 seconds) -- very helpful!
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SpazSinbad
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« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2010, 08:37:59 PM »

trent, OK thanks. Good to know CV NATOPS PDF is downloadable AND helpful.  Grin  The three PDFs in first post are in the 2GB PDF where these things you mentioned are mentioned over and over and over in some form or tuther (same as most carrier circuit diagrams on this forum which are mostly from NATOPS for that aircraft - there used to be Super Hornet diagrams - more or less same as Hornet diagrams, but these have often been deleted along with all the other good Super gen in deleted threads, this is why I generalise necessarily). Unless CV NATOPS says information is for a specific aircraft then it is general in nature, applying to all current aircraft AFAIK. The highest quality video in first post above is also included in 2GB PDF hence large file size.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2010, 10:31:14 PM by SpazSinbad » Logged

Sludge
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« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2010, 09:47:55 PM »

Spaz...

No worries.  IF I woulda just read it, I wouldve been fine.  If you wanna make the cautions more noticeable, yeah, but since I didnt read the initial cautions, I'm the only one to blame.

Trent...

Quote
At the 180, the aircraft should begin the approach turn and gradual descent to pass
the 90-degree position at 450 to 500 feet.

Do keep in mind the differences with FSX and real-world.  I have never been able to hit 450'-500' AT THE 90 when flying patterns.  If you can, please let me know your setup.  I'm guessing there might be a way to do it, but you'd have to be around 1.0 TCN at the abeam with about 20 kts boat speed and 18+ kts wind speed down the final bearing.  Then make your turn as soon as you see the "round-down" maintaining a full 30 AoB throughout.  I figure that's because the FSX meatball and all ICLS needles are programmed for a 4.0 carrier glideslope and the carriers are set for 24-25 kts?  I believe all these factors will put your numbers higher than in real life.

In example, when I'm at the 90... I'm passing 550 MSL, 1.2 TCN, and my glideslope needle comes up and I'm right on glideslope.  Thats with a carrier at 24 kts, 14 kts wind down final bearing (BRC - 9 deg)at 1.1 TCN Abeam, and started the 180 turn when I saw the round-down.

Keep us posted on your results.  BTW, now do you see why I wanted Spaz' take?  The man KNOWS CARRIER LANDINGS!!

Later
Sludge
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SpazSinbad
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« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2010, 01:04:46 AM »

Concise OLD but still valid couple of video clips embedded in several PDF pages describe 'how to fly the ball' basic techniques. These pages are from previous very large PDF described top of this thread. At only 90Mbs it is value for money & FREE:

http://www.filefront.com/17349862/DeckLandingInstructionVideos.pdf/ (90Mb)

Best to use latest Adobe Reader 9.3.4 which I believe will be updated today 05 Oct 2010. Windows users will get best result. Use the 'Download Now' yellow button at FileFront.
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SpazSinbad
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FLY NAVY! RAN FAA ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀ A4G Skyhawk Early '70s


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« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2010, 06:22:33 AM »

Carrier Landing Mishaps is a misleading title for this 1968 USN training video about? What else? Carrier Landings. This movie is otherwise about the causes showing details about how to deck land well (including how to catapult properly). I have been looking for actual Hornet training film without success:

http://www.archive.org/details/CarrierLandingMishaps

From 9 minutes 30 seconds approximately the details about 'how to carrier land' start.
__________________________

Down To The Wire is a terrific movie about new deck landers in T-2C Buckeyes.

http://www.archive.org/details/DownToTheWire
_______________________________


Not seen this one: "Hook Down, Wheels Down - U.S. Navy (More Historical than How to Deck Land)
Produced in the early 1970s, "Hook Down, Wheels Down" was one of the most comprehensive (and expensive) films made by the U.S. Navy. It covers the history and development of the U.S. aircraft carrier, and does so through interviews with many of the men who made it happen. While dozens of aircraft carriers are featured, it is the USS John F. Kennedy (CV-67) that takes center stage -- and the material shot on her deck looks like it is right out of "Top Gun"...

http://www.archive.org/details/HookDownWheelsDown
_________________________
http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=mediatype%3Amovies%20AND%20subject%3A%22navy%22
« Last Edit: October 05, 2010, 07:34:19 AM by SpazSinbad » Logged

Razgriz
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« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2010, 03:53:37 PM »

Carrier Landing Mishaps is a misleading title for this 1968 USN training video about? What else? Carrier Landings. This movie is otherwise about the causes showing details about how to deck land well (including how to catapult properly). I have been looking for actual Hornet training film without success:

http://www.archive.org/details/CarrierLandingMishaps

From 9 minutes 30 seconds approximately the details about 'how to carrier land' start.
__________________________

Down To The Wire is a terrific movie about new deck landers in T-2C Buckeyes.

http://www.archive.org/details/DownToTheWire
_______________________________


Not seen this one: "Hook Down, Wheels Down - U.S. Navy (More Historical than How to Deck Land)
Produced in the early 1970s, "Hook Down, Wheels Down" was one of the most comprehensive (and expensive) films made by the U.S. Navy. It covers the history and development of the U.S. aircraft carrier, and does so through interviews with many of the men who made it happen. While dozens of aircraft carriers are featured, it is the USS John F. Kennedy (CV-67) that takes center stage -- and the material shot on her deck looks like it is right out of "Top Gun"...

http://www.archive.org/details/HookDownWheelsDown
_________________________
http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=mediatype%3Amovies%20AND%20subject%3A%22navy%22

Spaz,
Those are some really cool and good movies, thanks for posting them.
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SpazSinbad
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FLY NAVY! RAN FAA ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀ A4G Skyhawk Early '70s


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« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2010, 07:37:38 PM »

No probs. Parts of these movies (not the historical USN one) are in the 4.4GB PDF (A4G Skyhawk & RAN FAA) / and 2GB how to carrier land PDF (excerpts from main 4.4GB PDF) and the smaller PDF as appropriate.

Did not realise until yesterday whilst looking for specific 'how to carrier land a Hornet' training video that these golden oldie movies were available online. BTW if anyone finds a USN Training movie about how to deck land [a HORNET specifically] would they please post that info in this forum please? Tah. Grin
« Last Edit: April 06, 2012, 10:12:39 AM by SpazSinbad » Logged

SUBS17
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« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2012, 06:23:36 AM »

Should sticky this thread as its good for learning carrierops.
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DigitAL
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« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2012, 06:56:41 PM »

What are you all getting for time-in-groove?
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SUBS17
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« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2012, 01:19:57 AM »

Depends about 28.5s on last approach.(4 wire though I was trying to miss it deliberately as I'm trying to record a bolter)  Grin
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