Addon Manager very low fps (10) P3DV4 **SOLVED**

[virtuali]

It’s very easy to judge where this problem form

No, it's not. You are confusing the cause with the effect. Since this is clearly video-drivers related, you THINK the problem has gone away by removing our software, just because no other addon is made to EXPOSE IT.

As explained in other threads, since a while ago (not since the last update, but since at least 3-4 months), we use some new functions in the P3D4 SDK, to get more direct access to screen updates, without using Simconnect, so we would be less affected by other addons spamming Simconnect with too many commands (distrupting our animations) AND we would spam Simconnect ourselves much less too, reducing the chance we'd do to the other addons what their might do to us. Ideally, all 3rd party addons should try to use such feature in the future, because it's way more efficient than Simconnect. This is called the PDK, and it's exclusive to P3D3+, but we only use it with V4.

HOWEVER, being more related to video drivers, it's possible this new API might be affected more by PROBLEMS, or more likely wrong "miracle" tweaks, either in the sim or in the video drivers you have applied, which might affect how this API works.

So, you DO have a problem, but you don't have an addon able to EXPOSE IT, unless you keep GSX installed. But of course, sooner or later, other developers will use the PDK, with more and more P3D4-only products coming out so, you'll have this problem even with no GSX installed, so you will be back to finding the REAL cause, which wasn't GSX of course.

Some other things to check for:

- Video driver tweaks. Try to remove ALL of them. Reinstall the drivers using the option to do a "Clean" reinstall

- Affinity mask tweaks. Remove all of them and just use the default, and see if there's any difference.

- Check/Uncheck the "Cap Simconnect updates" option in the Addon Manager menu, and see if there's any difference.

For those affected users, we might try making a special version of the Addon Manager that could be tweaked to NOT use the new PDK API, and revert back to Simconnect, likely with an .INI settings. However, it would be just a temporary hack to at least *confirm* the problem is in fact related to the usage of the PDK but, you will still have to fix it at your end because, we'll use the PDK more and more in the future and, I expect many more products will come out using it.

[jadolfo]

Hi Umberto,

Please read again:

Re-install windows and updated all driver / installed p3d & pmdg737 / gsx - still 12fps.,
........
when uninstall gsx everything back to normal 60fps+ When put everything a lot of addon without gsx it’s still 60fps.... ....

Like me, no tweaks, no tocuh .ini, not touch .cfg, not touch graphics driver... not touch nothing..

With all installed from default after a cleaning fresh Windows 10 installing, you insist on telling the user not to do things he has not done.

Some other things to check for:

- Video driver tweaks. Try to remove ALL of them. Reinstall the drivers using the option to do a "Clean" reinstall

- Affinity mask tweaks. Remove all of them and just use the default, and see if there's any difference.

If do you want, I can format again my hard disk and install only Windows 10, drivers, P3Dv4 and GSX and not touch anything. Then try if when undock a windows the fps goes down. Do you think this can help?

Thanks and best regards.

[alexvs]

I would love to try this opportunity. It makes GSX downward compatible, and that's great.

[virtuali]

I would love to try this opportunity. It makes GSX downward compatible, and that's great.

Yes but, it will only be a TEST version, released privately to the few affected users that might be useful as possible bug report to LM. It will never be an official option and won't ever appear in an official release, because we NEED the PDK function so, assuming they are the problem, the correct choice is NOT to cripple GSX forever, but helping LM understanding what might affect it on *your* systems.

[virtuali]

Please read again:

Re-install windows and updated all driver / installed p3d & pmdg737 / gsx - still 12fps.,
........
when uninstall gsx everything back to normal 60fps+ When put everything a lot of addon without gsx it’s still 60fps.... ....

I surely read it and, that's NOT a "clean" reinstall. It's a reinstall with GSX AND the PMDG 737. So, the only proper and complete test would be, instead of just uninstalling GSX, trying without installing the PMDG 737. Maybe there's some kind of conflict with don't know of.

Then try if when undock a windows the fps goes down. Do you think this can help?

This is the first time you said anything about undocking. Do you mean the fps goes down only after you undock a window ? Any window of the sim, or a specific one ?

Of course, I tried it now, by undocking all of these:

- The GSX (Simconnect menu) window. No fps change

- The default GPS gauge window. No fps change

- The default ATC window. No fps change.

I also tried setting the image quality to the max ( FXAA = On, 8xSSAA, Anisotropic 16x, Texture size 4096 ) and I noticed SOME fps loss when undocking windows, but nothing as remotely severe as reported here, like going down from about 80 fps on a default airport with a default airplane, to 65-70 fps.

And of course, I get the exact SAME fps loss with the Addon Manager disabled so, it's clearly a normal effect of having high anti-aliasing settings and undocked windows.

I'm sorry but, regardless how hard I try, I cannot reproduce this problem in any way.

[alexvs]

I would love to try this opportunity. It makes GSX downward compatible, and that's great.

Yes but, it will only be a TEST version, released privately to the few affected users that might be useful as possible bug report to LM. It will never be an official option and won't ever appear in an official release, because we NEED the PDK function so, assuming they are the problem, the correct choice is NOT to cripple GSX forever, but helping LM understanding what might affect it on *your* systems.

Offcourse, I understand it's a test version, only private use. If you have one, please PM me where to get the patch, to try and to investigate "what is my rig's problem". Then I can work on it to solve it.

[peteregan]

hi all.
i am having the same problem with huge frame rate drops with undocked windows. i use 6 monitors on 2 graphics cards. i had been using gsx for a long time with no problems then suddenly if i undocked a window onto a screen connected to my 2nd graphics card frame rate drops from a locked 32 to about 9. i can drag an undocked window half way onto another screen ok but as soon as it is fully moved framerates drop. i have done a full uninstall of nvidia drivers and p3DV4.2 then reinstalled. everything worked perfectly until i reinstalled GSX then the problem came back. disable GSX and all ok. i have now reinstalled all my other addons (loads of them) and sim runs perfectly, only GSX addon manager causes this problem. GSX is a great product and i hope a solution can be found, i need pushback and i enjoy watching the baggage handlers at work!
all the best and many thanks, pete.

[virtuali]

i had been using gsx for a long time with no problems then suddenly if i undocked a window onto a screen connected to my 2nd graphics card frame rate drops from a locked 32 to about 9.

This is the 2nd report the issue has something to do with undocking so, it clearly confirms several things:

- It's nothing that we can do about it, because we don't have any control and we don't even *try* to access the simulator windows directly.

- It's likely related to the new PDK function of the SDK, which we DO use. Not many (if at all), developers use them, which is why, you don't see it with other addons.

Unfortunately, we simply cannot just decide to stop using them, because they are the only way to do some fundamental features we require for the next GSX update and the new O'Hare, which is Render to texture, and using the official PDK is the only way to do it in the clean, proper and officially supported way, without resorting to the dark ages of dangerous hacks.

The only thing we can do, is confirm the problem is indeed related to the PDK, and report it to LM, assuming it still hasn't been fixed in the upcoming 4.3 release., which is very possible it has so, I suggest waiting for 4.3 to be released officially, and see if the issue is solved.

[alexvs]

I would love to try this opportunity. It makes GSX downward compatible, and that's great.

Yes but, it will only be a TEST version, released privately to the few affected users that might be useful as possible bug report to LM. It will never be an official option and won't ever appear in an official release, because we NEED the PDK function so, assuming they are the problem, the correct choice is NOT to cripple GSX forever, but helping LM understanding what might affect it on *your* systems.

Offcourse, I understand it's a test version, only private use. If you have one, please PM me where to get the patch, to try and to investigate "what is my rig's problem". Then I can work on it to solve it.

Hi Umberto,

What's the progress with the TEST version for the affected users?

[mwh1952]

i had been using gsx for a long time with no problems then suddenly if i undocked a window onto a screen connected to my 2nd graphics card frame rate drops from a locked 32 to about 9.

This is the 2nd report the issue has something to do with undocking so, it clearly confirms several things:

- It's nothing that we can do about it, because we don't have any control and we don't even *try* to access the simulator windows directly.

- It's likely related to the new PDK function of the SDK, which we DO use. Not many (if at all), developers use them, which is why, you don't see it with other addons.

Unfortunately, we simply cannot just decide to stop using them, because they are the only way to do some fundamental features we require for the next GSX update and the new O'Hare, which is Render to texture, and using the official PDK is the only way to do it in the clean, proper and officially supported way, without resorting to the dark ages of dangerous hacks.

The only thing we can do, is confirm the problem is indeed related to the PDK, and report it to LM, assuming it still hasn't been fixed in the upcoming 4.3 release., which is very possible it has so, I suggest waiting for 4.3 to be released officially, and see if the issue is solved.

I have been having similar issues to those logged in this thread. Low FPS (10-12) with GSX installed... regardless of whether undocked windows.
Following on from a suggestion above about installing an earlier version.. I did just that with my computer offline (network card disabled). Version installed reports as Addon Manager 4.0.0.5. The file version I installed from is dated 16/07/2017 and file version is 2.0.0.2   I do not have the low FPS with this release.
Not sure how much light this sheds but thought it worth adding to this thread.

m

[peteregan]

as another test, i did a clean install of p3d on a hard drive using windows 10 (i normally use 7). with p3dv1 no issues either docked or undocked, with p3d4.1 low framerates no matter what, and with p3dv4.2 only frame rate drops with undocked windows onto 2nd graphics card. obviously my hardware is the same across all of these tests. very strange behaviour.

[virtuali]

What's the progress with the TEST version for the affected users?

As I've said in several other posts, after attending the Flightsimexpo, we'll do a 2 week vacation in the US, and we'll be back in office June 25th.

And, since LM will release 4.3 sometimes in June, and the whole point of having a test version, is only to help us finding something to report to them, it doesn't make any sense even start working on it, considering 4.2 would be obsolete by then, and they surely won't be interested getting a possible bug report for 4.2, after 4.3 will be out.

So, let's first see if 4.3 will eventually fix your problem (again, as I've said so many times, nobody of us was ever able to reproduce it), and if it doesn't, we'll eventually work on a test version without the PDK features.

Note that, such version won't be fully functional, since we *REQUIRE* the PDK functions now so, it will not work entirely and couldn't possibly be used for anything other than a test to possibly submit a bug report to LM.

[alexvs]

Listen Umberto,

I have been cooparative for a long long time, especially helping you and others to find the problem. Your comment "(again, as I've said so many times, nobody of us was ever able to reproduce it)" did shut the door for me and made me furious. I don't like the tone of your comment. Even if you can't reproduce the problem yourself in a lab-situation, you can't deny that there is a problem with your software.

The problem came to light after you upgraded GSX with a new feature "PDK". It's your right to add this, but then you also have the obligation to ensure the software keeps on running with most common software and/or hardware combinations. That's called testing before you release something new. It's common sence in the software world. At least you have have the obligation, after introducing new features, to give the paying customer the choice to use the so called "PDK" or not. By giving them a menu switch or something to switch PDK ON or OFF.

You do not give us another choice then to wait for your return of vacation or the release of P3Dv43. Meanwhile nothing is done to help us. That's a very sad situation and observation.

[Eisbahn]

Do you never have a holiday?
Show some patience!
And by the way, his correct name is Umberto.

[jadolfo]

Even if you can't reproduce the problem yourself in a lab-situation, you can't deny that there is a problem with your software.

+1