Fueling issue for PMDG 737 NGX

[glc100o]

Hello,

I am familiar with the theory behind the method of fueling custom aircraft like the PMDG 737 NGX in GSX.  But I am having trouble with getting the fuel truck to acknowledge that I have refueled and leave with my workflow. Because I have limited time to devote to this hobby, I usually plan the flight with PFPX and then set up a scenario at a gate where all the data for the flight is entered into the FMC, short turnaround, and save it. Then I can come back later and go through boarding passengers, catering etc, and then go on the flight. So when the fuel truck arrives and it tells me to load fuel I have a problem with what sequence of keypresses will accomplish the refueling job and be acknowledged by GSX. Since my plan fuel is entered, I don't want to change it or everything computed for the flight will need to change. I note if I press the 1/3 or 2/3 or full buttons in the FMX GSX takes that as having refueled and the truck leaves. But it seems if I reenter what fuel weight is already there into the FMC, or even change it by a pound or two to make it think I have changed it,  I keep getting prompted by GSX to refuel and the truck will not leave. So I am missing something here.

If someone knows exactly what sequence  of FMC inputs [also do I need to press execute after re-entering the fuel?] I would need to perform with my fuel already loaded I would appreciate it. Otherwise I need to find a way to avoid the fuel  truck ever coming.

Thanks

Greg

[AFS]

Hello glc100o,

it's easy, but as you describe it here, it DOES NOT work.
Take a look at the GSX manual, page 17 and page 26.

But I will help you:

1) check your GSX settings! Open, while the simulator is running, the GSX setup. Addons -> GSX -> settings -> simulation.

2) The options "Always Refuel Progressively" and "Detect custom aircraft system refueling" must be activated. (Page 26/GSX manual).

That was it, considering GSX, too.


Regarding flight planning and refueling. It does not matter WHEN your plane is refueled and has no influence on your flight planning.

The correct amount of fuel must be loaded only BEFORE you make your input to the FMC (starting with "Position"). Why? Well, because your FMC is a computer that can only work with the right data.

For the tanker to work properly, you need to do the following:

1) open your FMC
2) go to FS-ACTIONS -> FUEL
3) LSK1 L shows you the current fuel weight (the fuel that will be pre-loaded at the start of the plane) in kg or gal.
4) depending on the operating condition (cold & dark or other) you call, note, that the APU need some fuel to run.
5) type a small amount (gal or kg) - I use kg and a minimum quantity of 300kg - so "300", in your FMC scratchpad.
6) You now see "300" in the bottom line of the FMC.
7) tap on LSK1 L and this value will be transferred. So your plane currently only has 300 kg of fuel (the same applies for gal).

So you're ready for the tanker, but stay in the FMC-Fuel menu.

8 ) Call the tanker via the GSX menu. While waiting for the tanker, type in your desired amount of fuel - the amount you have in your planning - into the FMC scratchpad. For example, 8500 kg, so "8500". These 8500 now appear in the bottom line of the FMC.
Then you wait until the tanker arrives.

9) the tanker arrives, positions itself under the wing and connects the filler neck. After that, you hear a beep and a gsx line appears, asking you to announce the volume.

10) tap on LSK1 L in the FMC and your set amount - 8500 in scratchpad - will be transferred to this line. the fill quantity now appears in LSK1 L "8499" (total kgs or gal). This minimal difference comes from  the fuel consumption of the running APU.

11) With this step you have entered the required data for further work on the FMC. Now you can leave the fuel menu and transfer the flight plan to the FMC and make all calculations and settings through the FMC - all correct.

But what does the tanker do?
The tanker fills the plane with the fuel-difference between existing - 300kg - and needed - 8500kg - fuel. So 8200 kg. You can see that on the running counter (animation) of the tanker - on the right side of it. Again and again, a gsx line is displayed, which indicates the already filled quantity.
When the refueling process is completed, the tanker leaves the aircraft.

Important! The filling is just a simulation and has NOTHING to do with the function of the FMC! There, it is sufficient to enter the correct amount of fuel, regardless of whether the tanker is finished with the filling or not!

I know it sounds complicated and a lot of work. But, if you know how, you only have to enter two digits and execute two mouse clicks. A "work" of a maximum of 10 seconds.


And, why does not it work for you? Well, you can not fill a full tank without first emptying it ...


I hope I could help you.

[Pirateinparadise]

That is the exact process I use.

The frustrating thing for me is that I am not entirely certain that I always integrate those steps with what I'm doing in the FMC properly. For example, I assume that if I go into the Takeoff page in the FMC and input the flap setting and then press the LSK to have it calculate %CG. that I should wait until after the "fueling process" is complete (when I enter the quantity in step 10 - pro tip: you can also enter the % of fuel to be added by entering the % of fuel desired and pressing the LSK next to % fuel on board) so that my CG will be calculated with the weight of the fuel on board.  

I have the same 'I might be doing it wrong' feeling when hitting the ZFW key to calculate that with regards to PAX count. It needs to be done after I set the proper payload in the FS options menu. If I do it before I set the payload with the correct information for the current outbound leg, it will use the payload from the previous inbound leg that I just completed. After I deboard a flight I usually immediately set the payload to zero, but sometimes I forget. It would be nice if GSX could automatically set the payload to "empty" as part of the deboarding process in preparation for the next flight. That's on my wish list

[AFS]

I can not quite understand your "problem". If you act logically, nothing can go wrong.

First, the number of passengers and the loading weight (front & rear) MUST be entered in the FMC. Then enter the amount of fuel. (Of course, only when the tanker is on site).
Only then are all the calculations of the FMC are correct, also the ZFW.

Especially for the 737 I use the tool TOPCAT. Here, the calculations are almost exactly to the point. However, you must NOT transfer the data, but you must enter manually into the FMC. The data transfer only works on planes without their own FMC because the TOPCAT-data are only transferred to the simulator's standard loading menu. But this has NO interface to the FMC of the PMDG!

Your request can also NOT be fulfilled by GSX, as many planes use their own loading manager, such as PMDG or Majestic (dash). A universal coupling of GSX to the standard loading menu of the simulator would thus be meaningless in most cases and is NOT the job of this program.


I also do not understand her problem with the loading weight. It does not matter if the weight is changed after unloading in the FMC or not.
It is up to you alone to set the new load. Whether, the cargo space is "empty" in the meantime or no,t for the function it does not matter. It only bothers you visually.

But if you value it, you can fix it yourself. All you need to do is set the load weight to zero, and if you want, set the fuel to a minimum amount (something the APU needs, too). Then save the "state" as panel state.
You can set this status as the starting point for the 737. Then they have what you want.

But NOTHING about what you're describing here has something to do with GSX.  

[glc100o]

Hi AFS,

After reading your detailed explanation and trying it out I see things are working ok with fueling now. I appreciate the detailed steps and clarifying things for me.

Greg

[hkhoanguyen]

1) open your FMC
2) go to FS-ACTIONS -> FUEL
3) LSK1 L shows you the current fuel weight (the fuel that will be pre-loaded at the start of the plane) in kg or gal.
4) depending on the operating condition (cold & dark or other) you call, note, that the APU need some fuel to run.
5) type a small amount (gal or kg) - I use kg and a minimum quantity of 300kg - so "300", in your FMC scratchpad.
6) You now see "300" in the bottom line of the FMC.
7) tap on LSK1 L and this value will be transferred. So your plane currently only has 300 kg of fuel (the same applies for gal).

Hi,
I did as close as you stated above, however, the fuel truck loads fuel instantly (within just 2 or 3 seconds) then leaves.

After arrival to the airport, I did as following :
+ Load RTE, choose runway, flight number and active EXEC
+ ENTER PAYLOAD
+ I leave FUEL qty as it is (in this case my arrival to the airport with only 2900kg Fuel left)
+ I called GSX Refuel
+ the truck comes and tells me to fuel the plane by its own system.
+ I goes to FMC, FS ACTIONS > FUEL and enter 8200 kg
+ The fuel truck starts working but in just 2 or 3 seconds it finishes,

Am i missing anything here ? Thanks I do have both options  "Always Refuel Progressively" and "Detect custom aircraft system refueling"  checked in GSX Settings.

Thanks a lot!

[eremusfly]

Same problem here.

[virtuali]

The only possible reason for the GSX fuel truck to go away after 2-3 seconds, is that you haven't checked the "Always Refuel Progressively" option.

I checked it again just now, using the same fuel figures from hkhoanguyen, that is 2900 kg before calling refueling and setting to 8200 kg from the fuel page on the FMC *after* the message to use the aircraft fuel system from GSX came, and the fuel counter on the fuel truck started to go up slowly, and it took some minutes to load 1745 Gals, which equals to 5300 ( 8200 - 2900 ) kgs

[eremusfly]

I am sorry, that option is checked, although it seems to be ignored. Refueling a PMDG 737NGX is hyper fast.
I also noticed that the settings provide a minimum refueling time option - no matter what - that's also ignored ...
 

[vc-10man]

I am sorry, that option is checked, although it seems to be ignored. Refueling a PMDG 737NGX is hyper fast.
I also noticed that the settings provide a minimum refueling time option - no matter what - that's also ignored ...
 

Fully agree with you. Same scenario for me despite ticking this and that in the GSX Options, so now I by-pass that GSX fueller and use the PMDG in-built via the FMC fuelling option. Far more realistic

[marknie]

How so? Can you list some steps please?  Thank you!

[marknie]

It is my understanding that PMDG did not provide progressive fueiling in the NGX or NGXu. If you want the animations, you have to use the 777 or airbus to get those animations.  Plus the steps posted earlier are incorrect. On the FMS use the ground operations and go to page 2. Its obvious from there.

[virtuali]

Please don't confuse the fact that, with the default configuration we made for the NGXu the Fuel Hydrant won't come ( because the wing is too low ), with the fact the fuel terminates fast, they are totally unrelated.

- When the refueling point is in its real position ( as we provided ), you see a smaller tanker, with a counter, and the refueling will go Slow or Fast, depending if the "Always Refuel Progressively" is Enabled or not.

- If you move the refueling point away on the external, so it will be higher than 3.40 meters from ground, you'll see the Hydrant with the raised platform, and the refueling will go Slow or Fast, depending if the "Always Refuel Progressively" is Enabled or not.

If you change the "Always Refuel Progressively", it will be active on the next airplane switch, or the next sim restart, or by Restarting Couatl. There will be no effect if you change it during the operation.